Ok Cari

GNHQ has really gone down in my estimation over this whole incident. They are appearing both priggish and dictatorial. They seem to be scared to lose face yet a wide range of posters have made it absolutely clear that they support jings and want her back. It takes a big person to say "I got it wrong - sorry" but that's what you need to do GNHQ.

Obieone, exactly, it's all down to interpretation isn't it?

NOTE - Jingle's opening post said "the next time I was reported you would ban me" - just "reported", not "judged by HQ to be bad enough to ban"!

Anyone can report any post, with or without justification, so if the ban automatically followed the report with no trial and sentence, it only took one person a moment to take umbrage, clype to teacher and get Jingle turfed out.

The point in question here is not specifically this one poster's banishment, it is the level of moderation and how evenly it is administered. Reporting a post is just bringing it to the attention of HQ. They are assumed to be reading it, looking at the context as well as what is in the post, and either emailing the poster to tell them it was a bit out of line or deleting it and telling the poster why, or in extreme cases ending that poster's membership.

What has been happening lately is that the mere fact of a report has been taken as enough to get a post deleted (particularly if that poster is Jingle). That gives too much power to the Bowdlerists and those with personal axes to grind.

We are aware that it takes time to consider all aspects of a report, but we do wish that HQ would bear in mind that this is supposed to be an unmoderated site with only the most flagrant breaches of the guidelines removed.

Yes ceesnan you are speaking for just some. As there are thousands of GN members we are only hearing from a very very small percentage. I threw my hat in the ring very early on this thread and nothing I have read has changed my mind.

Re voting with our feet if we don't like it versus making our opinions known - I can only speak for myself, but I don't want to leave! Ilike it here. I have many friends on Gransnet, and I enjoy all the discussions on different subjects with people who hold different opinions. Yes, even the ones who are unreasonable and provoke me to post a rant.

I completely understand why someone with a short fuse can be so provoked by some of the attitudes they meet that they reply at once and press the send button without censoring what they type. What I DON'T understand is the way an exchange of that kind ages ago is still rankling and causing some posters to demand a complete ban! It does smack of the same "personal attacks" that they reported back then.

BTW I have reported my post of 08:43:49 so that HQ see it. Great idea, Galen

Obviously the members here supporting jingles havent been at the other end of her nasty tongue! I know of a few that have and a couple have left because of her!

Only a couple?

Elegran

I don't know why you reported it I said something similar in my post 12.37 yesterday.

I call it 'trigger ready finger' to report. I am happy to reiterate I said this too.

" I feel some who might report another's post could be using the act of reporting others to use it as a 'personal tool' to covertly attack a poster who is opposing their view and use it to hinder a debate / discussion not going 'in the direction he/she wants '. Childish, yes but I think it does happen."

I feel sorry for GNHQ but I think it would do Gransnet a favour if the posts deleted stated more than 'broke forum guidelines'. Perhaps expand on what caused the deletion to at least let the deleted poster have the opportunity to redress the perceived problem.

E.G. a post is reported and subsequently deleted for being deemed by GNHQ to be a personal attack, then say that is the reason why.. The poster could be given the opportunity to apologise but as it stands the post is deleted and those who saw it may agree or not but those who didn't think blimey that must have been bad when it may not have been. It could simply be somebody who dishes it out doesn't like receiving back syndrome, who knows.

Some deletions I have read lead me to wonder why as I saw nothing to warrant a deletion and remain bemused why far worse posts remain on threads. That brings us back to the 'who' reported the post and why and I think sometimes thereby hangs the tale.

Again I say that we are lumping 2 different issues together.

I am far more concerned with the high-handed attitude of GNHQ - 'we know best'.

This is far from the first thread begging for J's reinstatement. I have never joined in the pleas for her return and won't now.
However I am very much in favour of a return to a more open approach and a discussion about what members want to see happen.

Your post of 8.43 sums it up Elegran

This is not just about jinglbellsfrocks - it is about GN and about all of us.

'One more reported post and you're out' is meaningless because someone could report a post for spurious reasons but the threat has been made and is carried out.

POGS I think Elegran reported her own post to make sure that GNHQ read it.

Actually, mumsy, some of us have been at the end of Jingle's sharp tongue. And yet we LIKE her general style of posting.

Obviously, HQ, we don't know what has gone on between you and Jings (rather than between the forums and Jings) but, as I said earlier, GNHQ should be big enough to cope with what they regard as a "difficult" GN member whom lots of gransnetters like. Maybe lots don't like her too. So there's a balance. What's the problem?

I don't know who said this originally but there's a saying that you're nobody until you have enemies. Jings is somebody. Please unban her.

OK, Lara, I'm with you on the cake scene — actually eating it for breakfast no.2. Have a good weekend, HQers.

When I first joined Gransnet I waited a while before joining an argumentative thread - I think it was about Amazon not paying their taxes.

I disagreed with someone and made the classic beginner's mistake of criticising the poster and not the post. This was pointed out to me by another poster so I apologised and we all carried on with no nastiness and no reporting.

It's frustrating when so many threads are stopped in their tracks by deleted posts which have probably been reported by members who have no intention of taking part in the discussion anyway.

It isn't just Chinese whispers, Daphne, jingl told thatbags on Twitter that she's been banned

If I could refer to what GNHQ has just assured us, it would appear that the "banning" if such it was, was not because of one deleted post and like reports of Mark Twain's death "somewhat exaggerated"
Hence my comment about Chinese Whispers, storms in teacups, mountains and molehills.
A Nelliemoser said several pages ago "Here we go again"
A load of conjecture about which comment was responsible (apparently none according g to GNHQ) "free the GN one" , was she wasn't she? how long can you be banned for (2 weeks obieone says ? )
The whole thread started as attention seeking (see page 1) and has exactly achieved its aim plus a deal of hot air and bad feeling along the way.
Don't people have better things to get wound up about?

SaphneB, it's a subject a lot of us feel strongly about, and although there may be more important things in the world to get wound up about that probably wouldn't do any good either.

Obieone, you can't just 'slip back quietly' if you've been banned. I don't think we're talking about a temporary ban here.

I'm sure that if, and hopefully when, Jings decides to join us again, GNHQ will not prevent her, they are not that dictatorial. However she will have to return with a new name as one cannot re-use an old name (otherwise I would still be Pompa)

While we wait with baited breath, [cake] for all.

Blimey!
Having trawled through this thread is seems to me tha GNHQ are damned if they do and damned if they don't ?
Sounds like a pretty thankless place to be Lara and GNHQ, and I think much of the criticism on here is verging on ganging up against you, almost buplying in my opinion, very sad.

HQ have already stated more than once that only a tiny proportion of reported posts are deleted and even fewer posters are banned. Perhaps if jingl hadn't drawn their attention to her previous warning then she wouldn't have been banned.

I didn't see the original supposedly offending post but I can't imagine any other GNer attracting such a devotedly vociferous following [hmm[

No, I'm not having that Lara ....I've had posts deleted recently which were not abusive by any stretch of the imagination. In the 'old days' when I had the odd deletion I always thought 'that's a fair cop!' BUT recently I've been left thinking 'what the hell?'

There are two issues here. How trigger happy some posters are to report anything and how easily some moderators are to oblige by deletions. This is why the accusation of ageism is being thrown up. Yes, compared with MN those on this forum are being treated very differently and we don't like it.

Then there's the issue with jingl. I agree she's a pain the neck sometimes but not enough to be banned surely?

And we don't see much of interest from moderators in the forums themselves. In the past there has been much more seen from moderators stepping in and adding some words of wisdom and perhaps a warning if things were getting a bit rough....sort of a Yellow Card. Why not tell a poster when their post has been reported, especially if it's a grey area, and just ask them to be more careful in future. Or how about looking at those who habitually report posts and tell them to grow a pair not to take things so personally.

I'm pleased to see input from Lara on this thread, but feel that HQ really ought to take in the sheer strength of feeling about the issues being addressed or this could just be another like GrannyNet which bored itself out of existence.

Buplying !!! the mind boggles

PS I'm not buplying anyone Loopy and I'm not a jingl fan (though there's a lot worse IMO) but there's such a thing as being treated as semi-senile and suggesting we all break from cake

Oops! More haste...etc
I wonder what the response to this thread would have been if jingl hadn't been banned?
GN doesn't carry through what it says it will do maybe?