Did Covid leak from a lab in China documentary Channel 4

Shocking. I've been pondering could any of it be fake news but I can't see any cracks?
So the Chinese lied. Still a lot of questions to be answered.

I wonder what the conclusions of the American report ordered by Biden will be later this week. Moving forward what the repercussions will cause.

Didn't realise there was more to come - off to search the link.

I saw a detailed programme about the start of the pandemic and it was clear that China had played it down while the virus was busy spreading. They denied it could be passed person to person while hundreds of people were dropping like flies in hospital. They didn't want to own up to starting a killer disease. By the time they did it was too late to contain it and as a result millions of people have died and the world is suffering huge financial and other losses.

I haven't watch the programme. But I have believed this since the very beginning of covid. And I speak as someone who counts China as their 2nd home. China does whatever it wants to achieve its aims.

I'm not even sure that it was accidental. NOT that I believe they intended to kill so many of their own but it was uncontrollable, once it was out. I think it was developed as germ warfare. Look how the Chinese economy has benefitted since covid.

I have always thought it was started by one of the two huge labs in Wuhan. I don’t think it was done on purpose, but you never know. I couldn’t buy the explanation of it being started in a wet market, I thought that a very poor and unlikely scenario. I’ve wondered about the germ warfare theory too.

I've thought this from the start too.

I’ve just heard a very interesting report on the Today program.
There has been a huge propaganda campaign in China to make the Chinese believe that Covid originated in the US.
It was really quite alarming.

I’ve always thought it came from Wuhan and that the Chinese played down the problem and the number of deaths in China.

I never thought anything other than the lab theory.
Months ago there were leaked photos in the press showing terribly health and safety measures, including poorly sealed fridges.

I thought that too Maddyone so many people decried it as a conspiracy theory though.

That is quite plausible because at Pirbright there was a drainage leak a few years ago which caused a local Foot and Mouth outbreak. Thankfully contained to just a few cases, research into contagious human disease is very dangerous because isolation is never 100%, there is always some risk.

When I first voiced this on here I was poo-pooed and told it was a fake conspiracy theory by two on the fringe scientists who first suggested it. Now it is being accepted on here as very likely.

The US and France were supporting these labs and I think they were experimenting with the virus gathered from bats. Unfortunately I believe the hygiene security was not up to scratch and that is how it escaped. Not deliberate but avoidable. It’s quite scary wondering what next. I’m sure things go on at Porton Down we aren’t told.

Didn’t watch that, but did hear similar the other day - I think on the BBC World Service during the small hours.

I gathered that the US was engaged on similar research - IIRC modification of certain viruses, and some years ago at least one Chinese scientist was involved in that research.

But the US research was stopped during Obama’s presidency - a moratorium on funding, IIRC because it was considered too potentially dangerous - but the same research continued in China.
Sounds plausible enough to me, but since China is never going to come clean - not unless some whistleblower moves to another country - I don’t suppose we’ll ever know for certain.

This has always been a possibility from day 1.

The big problem is, of course, that the Chinese will not allow any independent outside investigators to carry out a through investigation to determine whether this is possible or not.

It is a bit like the Russians and the poisonings in Salisbury. You can deny it all you like, but while you will not allow a dteailed analysis of everything thaat happened in your on country, such denials tend to incriminate.

I thought so too and isn't it strange how pretty much all of the PPE and thousands of items we buy online are made in China! An attempt at world supremacy perhaps???

We’ve known this right from the start, nothing new there. The only question is why, was it an accident, was it some sort of sabotage or was it planned? The scientists are usually extremely careful. Wuhan is a very ‘developed’ city, we were there a few years back before Covid.

I don’t think it’s quite like the Salisbury poisonings, since in that case the meticulous examination of so much CCTV and of the two Russians’ movements, made it IMO pretty obvious.

In particular the fact that they’d been issued passports with directly consecutive numbers - what’s the likelihood of that, for two supposed friends just off on a jolly?

It was 100% a given that Russia was never going to admit it, though. And I doubt that any emigrant whistleblower would ever dare, since s/he would very likely end up the same way as the Salisbury victims.

Just because something is plausible that doesn't mean that it happened.

We console ourselves by thinking that this must have been man-made because not only does it give us the bad guy to blame, (China), it means we can stop it happening again. Its much more scary that this is a naturally occurring virus and that this is what happens in nature, especially in the nature we are impacting with our human society.

Could be man made, yes, but I'm going to plump for naturally occurring. Let's see.

No, not quite like, but the reaction of Russia, has been like that of China, to deny the allegations and refuse to open up to an independent investigation - and that is the bit that makes one assume guilt, more than anything else.

I think the we have to accept that we shall never know the circumstances surrounding the emergence of Covid-19.

We console ourselves by thinking that this must have been man-made because not only does it give us the bad guy to blame, (China), it means we can stop it happening again.
To me the most important thing is that the virus wasn't contained effectively at the start and China did not inform the world soon enough what was happening. It's all on record with dates. So yes, that makes them 'the bad guy', no matter how the virus started.

Oh, I don't disagree that China acted inexcusably by trying to cover up what was happening, and still are trying to thwart the investigation. But that isn't the same as actually creating the virus in the first place, or releasing it deliberately.

Essentially I think the virus was leaked from one of the laboratories accidentally. That doesn’t mean that it couldn’t have been done on purpose, but realistically I don’t think it was done on purpose. The pictures shown of people working inside the laboratories without full PPE and of the faulty seals on the fridge doors show that security was lax. I have wondered about the possibility of the virus being man made as germ warfare, and I don’t think that can be excluded. The virus was being experimented on and we have to ask ourselves why. I don’t have any answers and since the Chinese are unwilling to even allow the WHO to investigate fully, I think it’s unlikely that we’ll ever know.

I am surprised by the fact that people don't thank this could have happened naturally. Transfer from animals to humans is a common way for diseases to start.

Warnings from 17 years ago that the wet markets are going to be a problem: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7112390/

don't think !!