The Reckoning - Savile

I wouldn't want to watch it. I am fed up with distressing programmes. That's why this evening we are watching Andre Rieu - not my thing at all but at least it's cheerful.

I watched it and like you primrose I am not a Coogan fan but he sounded remarkably like him and I mean remarkably
It was watchable but nothing we didn’t know already but an interesting reminder of how he had the Catholic Church wrapped around his little finger

I really dislike programmes offering even more publicity about unacceptable behaviour like that of JS. What purpose does it serve?

I think I need to watch - and it has purpose - as we all need a reminder/update on exactly how these twisted characters manage to fool the majority of people, exert power, get access to vulnerable children - for so long - without any questions or consequences.

I always thought he was sleazy as I'm sure many did - yet still, he got away with it.

Mollygo

I really dislike programmes offering even more publicity about unacceptable behaviour like that of JS. What purpose does it serve?

You could ask what purpose any drama serves which covers real life horrors. What about the millions of war films and TV series covering events which we already know about.......or do we? Don't forget there are always going to be younger generations who don't know about the war, or who don't know about Jimmy Savile. They need to know.

Chestnut

Mollygo

I really dislike programmes offering even more publicity about unacceptable behaviour like that of JS. What purpose does it serve?

You could ask what purpose any drama serves which covers real life horrors. What about the millions of war films and TV series covering events which we already know about.......or do we? Don't forget there are always going to be younger generations who don't know about the war, or who don't know about Jimmy Savile. They need to know.

Yes, I think we need to be reminded of just what a high profile figure can get away with if we don't have in place all the checks and balances to prevent men like him exploiting their position and popularity.

And as a reminder that when you feel uncomfortable about a person's behaviour and people say things like, "oh, he doesn't mean anything by it" or "it's just his way", to trust your instincts.

I still can't believe that the culture was such that so many people were 'aware' but refused to do anything.

I still can't believe that the culture was such that so many people were 'aware' but refused to do anything.

I can’t either, but I’m grateful for the off button.

Mollygo I think it’s hugely important, it’s a reminder, a warning, and shows just how easily it is for a young impressionable person to get pulled in and it shows how someone with a personality of being a ‘saint’ can be covering up a true sinner so that even the church was taken in by him

I while back a friend told me how when she was young her and her friend went to see a young Gary Glitter perform and afterwards they went round to the stage door to try and get his autograph she got fed up waiting and went home but the friend didn’t and then didn’t arrive home until the next morning because he had invited her to his room!!! Need I say more …. they were 16
I m glad you found the off button but that’s your preference and I think these reality dramas do serve a purpose

Also it shows the nauseating tendency for high profile people to be able to bluff their way through. That is our fault and the fault of those, like the tv producers, enabling them. I don’t think this toerag should be given air time at all, good or bad.

I agree with Dickens. There should be checks and balances in all areas of life political, commercial, entertainment, educational, religious and more. Trust your instincts in daily life. Question inappropriate behaviour. Don't be dazzled by fame or fortune. Keep an eye out for those who could be vulnerable. Teach our children to stand up for themselves and listen to them. If this programme initiates discussions as to how could it have happened and can it still happen, then it is an important programme.

I watched the first half hour - but it made me feel so uncomfortable I had to switch off, I think because Steve Coogan's depiction was so spot on and I always found Saville to be creepy

It’s so easy to say don’t be dazzled by fame trust your instincts but we are talking about young vulnerable people here
Didnt you ever do anything daft when you were young I remember going out for a few dates with a man years older than me I was 16 he was about 26 and separated I thought I was so sophisticated and it was such fun because I knew my parents would have forbidden it, he had a car !!! And was interested in me thankfully he didn’t go past a snog, but I would have if he’d tried my head was well and truly turned

Steve Coogan's voice and mannerisms were spot on , the editing was seamless , old footage woven with the acting made it all sickening . I was always repulsed by JS and obviously others were too but still it happened - he railroaded over everyone with his aggressive, weird dominance . Gosh , I'm not sure how to describe the creep . But well done to Steve Coogan for taking this on .

Bluebelle My comment about dazzled by fame and fortune is directed at adults who are often dazzled and lose their sense of proportion.
Adults must look out for the vulnerable whether a youngster or a vulnerable adult. And this didnt happen enough. Those who should have done didn't.

Of course I did silly and often now I think back dangerous things. Everyone does. But the world has changed dramatically since my youth,

As far as I am aware those hiring this man, many of whom said they felt uneasy around him, still went ahead and employed him. I don’t think these people were children. Just sick people who chased money and fame over their so called scruples. No excuses for them.

Agreed helterskelter and we must be more attuned to danger for others but would the young people listen I know I wouldn’t have It’s really hard to put the blame on anyone other than the sycophantics and those who heard the rumours for years and did nothing
I didn’t realise Steve Coogan started his career as an impressionist hence the brilliant portrayal He’s someone’s I ve never taken much notice of except I thought he was good in Phillomena
My biggest disappointment is that Saville didn’t live to get a punishment

I actually gave up but will go back to it.
Perhaps it’s testament to the acting, the production values, or what but it left such a bad taste in my mouth, bringing it all back.
I too let the girls write in to “Jim’ll Fix It” - thank god they got no reply, but I shared in the gullibility of so many at the time.
Unsettling to know what we know now and think of the lucky escapes for some.

The other thing to remember is how little we knew and understood about child sex abuse 30 or more years ago.

Do you remember all those jokes about vicars and choir boys, bishops and actresses? We warned our children not to go off with strange men and I can remeember saying to my children that if any body did anything that made them feel uncomfortable, even if it was their father or grandfather or close friend - I had no reason - to think they would, they should always tell me, but it was more just saying what was recommended.

Jimmy Saville's behaviour dated back well before then, as long as he wasn't doing it in the street and frightening the horses, people would rather ignore the issue, because few of us then realised the extent or the serious of what was happening, nor the effect it had on the child victime.

Steve Coogan is a good actor and has talked in interviews about the conflicted feelings he had when offered this part.

I haven’t watched the drama but I will do. I was warned by older girls when going to a Manchester club where he DJ’d to keep away from him. They thought I’d be safe because as a tall just 16 year old, I wasn’t his type. He liked the 12 and 13 year olds, they were the ones he played records for and invited back to his room. 1964.
He always made my flesh crawl.

It was interesting to see that even his mother sensed a darkness in him and couldn't bring herself to feel any love for him. Didn't she say to the priest in the confessional that he'd been her seventh child and she hadn't wanted him when he was born. Strangely though, he seems to have cared a lot for her.

Although I agree it should be made for the benefit of those who don't remember, I'm not sure I can cope with watching him again so might give it a miss. Apart from all his many TV appearances there was a programme about him and I remember Louis Theroux interviewing him in some detail so I've had quite enough.

The BBC are getting a lot of criticism for making it, having turned a blind eye to him while he was earning them money.

BlueBelle,
I think it’s important, but how many teenagers/young people do you think were watching it? I asked all my DGC stretching from early teens to early twenties, if they’d seen Steve Coogan in the programme about JS.
Responses
Youngest said Who’s Steve Coogan? Who’s JS? No she didn’t watch the programme. Yes she had heard about creepy men, you shouldn’t be alone with them or go places where they can trick you into sex.
Yes they were taught about grooming at school.
Middle teens didn’t watch it-^we get told about different ways of grooming at school and that’s quite enough.^
Did I know that some girls still do it even when they know?
The oldest one had heard of JS, but didn’t watch it and nor did her friends.
The only one who did watch it was one of the late teens DGS. He said it was interesting because it happened in history when you were young Grandma. Which put me in my place!
He thought it was appalling and couldn’t understand why adults had not done anything about it, but didn’t believe the children would have listened back then because they still don’t now.

One of my DDFs wrote to him - I am very glad she got no reply. I thought he was a creep, but let her write in as I assumed (wrongly) that there would be protections in place for participants.

Incidentally it did cause us some amusement as she wrote "Dear Jim'll" - she thought that was his first name and "Fixit" his second.

The acting yesterday was superb. Coogan had him down to a T.

I felt very angry with the Theroux programmes on him. It was clear Theroux could see that things were seriously wrong but on he ploughed to earn his crust. And his squirming attempts to justify his actions in his autobiography were not edifying reading.

How did this dreadful man get away with it all? - not just the sexual abuse but the general invading of personal space with everyone, and flouting rules unchallenged.

I think it is important that this programme has been made, challenging though it is, as we should never forget how easily a forceful/?charismatic person can charm us into submission. We need to be on our guard.

DDF = DD