A discussion of the possibility of an enhanced virtual cruise

RayArt

To be clear for those who'd like to join in one or other. The learning Italian one will also be omnivore?

What is Argy and non-Argy?

RayArt wrote To be clear for those who'd like to join in one or other. The learning Italian one will also be omnivore?

Well, I am trying to be a superb diplomat over this.

The river Main one is specified as vegan, and indeed as a result of that a vegan restaurant was found and enjoyed.

For the virtual cruise with the option for learning Italian I have tried to balance my vegan views with not wanting to try to force my vegan views on others, so sort of hoping that others don't mention non-vegan food unless it gets mentioned in the learning course, basically as mutual courtesy amongst participants. That seems a reasonable way to proceed as it does not need to be an issue.

> What is Argy and non-Argy?

Well, again, in superb diplomat mode, it is the style of discussion and comment in the thread. The virtual cruise along the river Main is non-Argy in what is said.

The first virtual cruise in the South of France started in what now, retrospectively can be termed non-Argy style, but, became largely Argy style. The second virtual cruise, in which I did not participate was Argy style.

As it happens I dislike Argy style and do not want to participate in Argy style discussions, but it is possible to have two virtual cruises, each in a different style from the other, running at the same time.

I know that some people do not like non-Argy style.

I regard it as like some people like to go to parties with drinking and some people would rather go to an art gallery, like at exhibitions they have a bar and they have a tea and coffee lounge. Freedom of choice.

eGJ

Thanks for the updates StarDreamer. Is it easy to switch on Duolingo to private? Will have glance at site later on.
However I am enjoying the music in Hassfurt and will travel with you to Bamburg. Hope the train journey to Venice in this heat isn’t too tiring!

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Buddy, you are not coming across as a superb diplomat at all. You are coming across as passive aggressive and controlling.

Firstly, every foreign language I have ever learned involved learning the vocabulary of food. Most courses start with introductions, people meeting and ordering a coffee or tea with or without cream or milk, ordering a beer or glass of wine that's unlikely to be vegan, going to the market, going to a restaurant. Meat and fish are a big part of the Italian diet. If you impose rules like that you deny others the chance to learn the vocabulary they need to know if they are going to use what they learn in any practical sense. Teaching is all about inclusion but you want to exclude. Why? People can’t be on edge all the time worrying about your sensitivities because of a diet you choose.

Secondly, you haven’t explained what Argy style is or who these other people are who don’t like it? Whatever it is, how do you know? I need some examples of what Argy style is.

If you are talking about the French cruises there was both a wealth of art and a party atmosphere. Why can’t there be both? I like looking at art with a glass of wine. Member evenings at MoMA wouldn’t be the same.

Nobody is going to argue about having freedom of choice but there’s also freedom of speech which it sounds like you want to control.

Well there is a difference between a few words in a course and people pushing omnivore.

I note you go to MoMA.

Have you been in the sculpture garden.?

Are you living near to MoMA such that you go in there often?

So, what do you want me to do about the virtual cruise along the river Po?

I don't regard it as controlling freedom of speech, it is a matter of how people conduct themselves according to the occasion, and the types of occasion people want to frequent.

For example, an evening party is different from being in an art gallery.

It would be best if one of the people who likes Argy style describes it to you.

Buddy, you are not coming across as a superb diplomat at all. You are coming across as passive aggressive and controlling.

As are you actually RayArt; if you dont want to join us on the virtual cruises, or join in on the Duolingo courses, you're perfectly free to abstain or start one yourself. Those of us who do join StarDreamer on them are perfectly happy with the content as it is and are grateful for his gentle directions.

Oh, and "Argy" means argumentative. "Non Argy" is not argumentative. Hth.

People pushing omnivore? Man has been eating meat for almost 3 million years. You make it sounds like a Class A drug.

Conduct themselves? What do you mean?

You haven't been to MoMA? They have evening parties first Thursday each month.

Look, this is just weird. I’m going to butt out now and wait to see if Joseanne returns to say what she has in mind.

If anyone can enlighten me on what this mystery Argy style is I’d sure like to know. If it's banned on this language cruise but people don't know what is how do people know how to conduct themselves?

If anyone can enlighten me on what this mystery Argy style is I’d sure like to know. If it's banned on this language cruise but people don't know what is how do people know how to conduct themselves?

See above post @ 20.56, last paragraph. I think you'd prefer the Argy version.

I just looked-up passive-aggressive as I was unsure what it means.

If people upset me I do tend to avoid them, yes.

But I am never sarcastic. I am very literal. I have at times thought that a remark that turned out to have been sarcastic was true.

Before the pandemic, one day my grocery was delivered by a man who was not one of the regulars, and I was unloading from the trays at my usual slow pace, and he said "Take your time, I've got all day" and I said "Thank you, that's very considerate of you." It was only a while after he had gone that I wondered if he was saying the opposite of what he meant.

There is a culture in England amongst some people of saying the opposite of what they mean and expecting people to realise that that is the situation. Sometimes they get upset if one takes what they say as true. It is a very peculiar situation.

I am learning and recognise it sometimes. I think someone did that yesterday in a thread where I had explained something.

Does it happen in America or is just something in England that some people do?

As I have got older I have tended to accept being treated unfairly by some people is just how it is and just not let it distress me but to find happiness where I can find happiness.

I have no wish to be an alpha male. I like to achieve, but I am not interested in winning.

I don't feel a need to gain something by disadvantaging others, in fact quite the opposite.

I'm still here. I would like to join a virtual cruise but one like the French ones. I said that right off the bat. This is meant to be a discussion so I am discussing. Free speech. If Stardreamer means the French cruises were Argy style and Argy style is argumentative why not just say so? Anyhow, the gals on the French cruises weren't arguing. They were having a huge amount of fun. Again, I'll wait for Joseanne to say what she has in mind as she was the chef.

That’s interesting RayArt and StarDreamer ! Presumably you are not NY neighbours (no Tesco ) but of course there is also the Scottish National Gallery of Modern Art in Edinburgh which I have heard referred to locally as “MoMA ”.
But Cbewbacca - I was never a regular in the Argy, like Lemongrove and others, but as I remember, argumentative it’s not! Funny, humorous, satirical maybe - but not “argumentative” !

You're not passive aggressive StarDreamer, far, far from it. You're being bullied by someone who is, for some bizarre reason, trying to "win". Please don't change either the style or the content of your virtual cruises, they've given me, and many others, an opportunity to travel and see things that we wouldn't otherwise be able to experience and they've been thoroughly enjoyable.

Argy, like Lemongrove and others, but as I remember, argumentative it’s not! Funny, humorous, satirical maybe - but not “argumentative” !

That's true enough Maw but not everyone can take or understand that type of humour and StarDreamer is, I think, one of those people.

I thought Argy style referred to a more casual, chatty, friendly, humorous style of communication as previously exemplified on Gransnet on the threads centred on a virtual pub, The Argy. It’s a style of humour that some people here do not like / understand? A bit risqué, a bit letting yourself go, having actual fun……

Yes Shirley, banter. As you say, not everyone likes or understands it and prefer to avoid it if possible.

Do you have a season ticket RayArt?
I am sooo envious - I'd love to visit New York❤️

Thank you. I didn't know that. I guess SNGMA doesnt roll off the tongue even for the Scottish people! I was talking about MoMA in New York.

THE Argy! At last! Out of frustration I put it in the search box and found out it's a bar that opens for special occasions. It all looks very good humored to me and a similar style to the French trips. I can't imagine what anyone could find offensive about the conduct.

Chewbacca

Yes Shirley, banter. As you say, not everyone likes or understands it and prefer to avoid it if possible.

It’s just you suggested it was ‘argumentative’ or ‘non-argumentative’, which is not right in this instance. I know, colloquially, people talk about an argy bargy, but I think on the cruise thread in question it was described as Argy like, because there was quite a bit of jokey banter.

I’m off, anyway. Please accept theses flowers

RayArt asked Conduct themselves? What do you mean?

That is normal English as spoken in England.

How one conducts oneself is how one behaves.

Like good conduct or bad conduct.

> You haven't been to MoMA? They have evening parties first Thursday each month.

No I have never been to MoMA.

I first learned of MoMA when Google advertised street view views inside various art galleries, one of which was MoMA.

Different from many others in that the street view presentation had the foyer, in the days before it was rebuilt.

Also MoMA has the sculpture garden.

I have looked at the MoMA website and they offered me the opportunity to be on their mailing list for emails and I accepted and I watch various of the MoMA videos on YouTube.

And the MoMA design shop sends me emails of products that they are selling and although I haven't bought any yet I find looking at what is on offer interesting.

I get emails from various art galleries, art card publishing websites and so on. Reading them, thinking about them, wondering what I could do, helps keep my mind active, maybe it will stop me getting dementia.

RayArt

I'm still here. I would like to join a virtual cruise but one like the French ones. I said that right off the bat. This is meant to be a discussion so I am discussing. Free speech. If Stardreamer means the French cruises were Argy style and Argy style is argumentative why not just say so? Anyhow, the gals on the French cruises weren't arguing. They were having a huge amount of fun. Again, I'll wait for Joseanne to say what she has in mind as she was the chef.

Actually I had not realised that Argy stood for argumentative.

In retrospect that seems peculiar now I have learned that, but I didn't know until just now.

I don't have a particular style of communication, so won't comment.

I do, however, have a penchant for good living and a flair for cooking, so would be happy in this rôle. The trouble for me is that part of the travel experience is to sample the local produce, (I am in Brittany this month so it's shellfish and dairy), which means I wouldn't be suited to the vegan option.
Mind you, I did think we could drop by Amal's place on Lake Como and try her breakfast recipe of seaweed soup. That would be vegan I assume?
And George could serve us coffee. ☕

www.gransnet.com/forums/chat/a1304199-A-Very-Argy-Christmas

www.gransnet.com/forums/chat/a1311176--The-Argy-Re-Opens-Lubbly-Jubbly-Celebrations

www.gransnet.com/forums/chat/1295694-The-Argy-Conglomerate

Hi Joseanne. I'm game for hanging out with the Clooney's in Italy. Not sure about the seaweed.

Are we clear now (am I clear now?) about what Argy style is? That's it's having fun in a bar or when travelling, that it isn't arguing and never was. It's the name of a virtual bar here.

Yep, you got it, RayArt

Thank you. It's looks like a friendly and popular place. I'll look forward to when it next opens.

Oh, are we off again, causing unpleasantness?
I'm afraid diplomacy isn't a strong point of mine.