Mum and Dad relationship

Your father was ignoring it and so you picked a fight.

Oh my. Didn’t see that one coming.

No I would not to risk the safety and well being of my children
1cr and although I may have facilitated a relationship between someone as you describe being a relative, and my children, if I had any concerns I would never have allowed them to have my children without my supervision.

You say have forgiven your brother for the past because you understand why he behaved as he did, yet seem unable to understand that those very reasons will most probably be why he hasn't stood up for you now. You even say his focus is probably on your parents will; like I said, inconsistencies.

Some careful consideration is needed as to how you can maintain distance from your parents, while allowing the relationship you have enabled to develop between them and your son to continues.

If that isn't going to be possible perhaps non physical contact via cards, emails, Face time, birthday and Christmas gifts may be the way to go until your son is older.

Smileless2012 - yes good point about my brother. I hadn’t thought of that.

How do you mean inconsistencies?

Oh yes, we will consider everything but the fact don’t recognise the damage they do makes me question how the same things wouldn’t happen with my son.

That's what I don't understand 1cr and what I mean about inconsistencies. You've allowed your parents to have unsupervised contact with your son, despite your concerns about what "damage" they may do.

Yes - but we hadn’t told them all of the info up until now. I expected when bullying was brought up they would “act” but they just ignore it.

So that’s why we have removed him now.

We had already stopped him going there in a morning pre-school due to how he was getting overly worried if he forgot minor things for school.

JosieGc

Hi there. Just wanted to say I am shocked about some of the lack of compassion shown to you here. I actually don’t normally comment on here but my heart goes out to you.
I can understand your sadness and your feelings are valid. When we have complex difficult relationships with our parents and we see them interacting with our children in the same way it can be very upsetting and triggering. This was about a pencil on the surface - but it was also nothing to do with a pencil at the same time. It’s to do with how your parents behave in a hurtful, unreasonable and demanding way then seemingly stonewall your valid feelings about being treated in that way. You could choose to ‘smooth’ it over; or you could say no. It sounds like you’ve opted to say no, which a lot of people do when they see their parents bad behaviour threatening to extend to their children. Follow your gut instinct and trust yourself. Are they healthy people? Do you want your son absorbing anxiety from them? Is this a one off or is it likely to happen again? Willsome of the upsetting things that happened to you as a child repeat themselves?
It doesn’t sound from your description like they would respect your parenting style and values - or the behaviour that you want around your child. It also sounds as if you are a very different parent to them.
For what its worth, if this were my child I would have done exactly what you did , I would have raised it and I would have pulled back from the relationship if I had received the stonewalling you have. It’s your job to protect and care for your children and promote relationships with healthy people. It’s also your job to respect yourself and let people know when they’ve crossed over boundaries, in this case causing your child to worry. However, it sounds like you will never get the validation or the acknowledgment you rightly want from your parents. If I were you I would get the compassion and understanding you deserve elsewhere - visit a therapist and work through those feelings of sadness, which are absolutely valid and understandable . You don't want to be re traumatised by your dads refusal to acknowledge your feelings, especially over something as dear to your heart as your child . And I would keep promoting healthy behaviour to your child and calling out unhealthy behaviour as you see it. Good luck - its a hard path your walking , all you can do trust your instincts and make sure you are emotionally healthy, even if your family of origin are not. Take care.

JocieGc

^^ This

Do you mean your parents didn't "act" when you told them how your brother had bullied you when you were a child, or do you mean they knew at the time but did nothing to prevent it?

If the former, what action did you expect your parents to take?

Now your son is not going to his GP's in the morning before school, is he no longer anxious if he forgets anything? Do you know for certain that it was his GP's responsible for his anxiety or was that because of the school's reaction?

In any event, surely it's the responsibility of parents to ensure that their young child has everything s/he requires for the school day, rather than expecting a 6/7 year old to remember for themselves.

Surely if you knew your son was forgetting things for school and that was making him anxious, you and your wife would have ensured he had everything he needed.

By the time he was at your parents to be taken to school, it would be too late for any omissions to be taken care of as he wasn't in his own home.

I expected/wanted them to stand up for me and tell me it shouldn’t have happened. That’s prob the child coming out in me.

I also wanted them to know what brother is/was like - as they think they have a great relationship, but forget he keeps them at arms length and has never had a girlfriend. He’s in his 40s.

With regards forgetting things, my mum and dad would expect us to take multiple things to theirs every morning (including things we had borrowed like pencils!) along with all his school stuff and spare clothes etc etc and if we forgot anything they round create an uneasy atmosphere.

At times we could a spelling book for example and they would create the atmosphere which made him worry,

Now he doesn’t go there we just focus on what he needs for school.

On occasions we forget things (twice in 12 months) he doesn’t really care as we’ve explained we are human beings who CAN forget things.

I hope you'll continue with counselling as you need to let go of the past. I can understand your need for your parents to acknowledge your brother's bullying was wrong. Perhaps their failure to do so is there inability to accept that they failed you.

You also need to accept that your brother's relationship with your parents is his. Their relationship with him appears to be resulting in jealousy on your part, and your own is understandably coloured by the past.

Not having a close relationship with him, you'd not necessarily be aware if he's ever had a girlfriend, and I'm not sure why that's relevant even if he hasn't. Your parents may well be aware that he keeps them at arms length, and are content with that as from what you've posted, none of you appear to be particularly close.

We cannot change the past. We cannot make people into the people we would like them to be. We have to work with what we've got if we want a relationship, or walk away if we don't.

No jealousy - I just want everything to be out there. Then if they continue to see him and love their false life, their choice.

Apart from that, fair enough yes no issues with that.

"I just want everything to be out there. Then if they continue to see him and love their false life, their choice" well it may not be jealousy but you have a serious issue with your parents relationship with your brother, and I wonder if this is the real source of the problem, rather than your perception of how your parents behaviour impacts on your son.

I would love to hear the grandparents version of the issue between them and the OP.

Its always a small thing that breaks the camels back ,small to everyone else but compounds all the other stuff you had to live with.If anyone had caused my kids to feel anxious over a stupid pencil I'd have gone nuts at them.
My fil had issues with me for a long time and did things with my children just to wind me up,nothing dangerous ,but he would take them to the Orange Walk when he knew fine well it was something I totally disgreed with.I just kept them home during the marching season after a couple of years of asking MIL to make sure they didn't get taken.
There were lots of wee things that went on but th Orange walk would have stopped me letting them stay .My MIL was lovely and they both loved my children but I strongly disagree with "grannies house grannies rules" They are NOT the GP'.s children so if they cant stick with parents rules they cant have them ...simple .Granny and Grandpa in your case ramped up anxiety so you are quite right to keep them away from the harm that causes .I wish you well ,without your toxic family .

Smileless2012 - yes there is a jealousy that he will get a massive will and I will get nothing despite the years of emotional abuse. Half joking.

Esspee - yea they blame it all on my anxiety. They blamed what my son said on my anxiety for the way I took it despite we have YEARS experience of this with them.

paddyann54 - ?

I think perhaps you are projecting how you were treated by your parents as a child on to how they are interacting with your ds. So you relate everything back and relive all the pain and anger they caused you which understandably you don’t want your ds to experience. Grandparents often treat gc totally different from the way they treated their own children.

I do think you need to try and chill out on this. Is your ds that anxious or is you that is anxious for him? Does he want to visit his gp’s? Is he covering up how he feels so as not to upset you? Can you talk quietly to him and see how he feels - does he like gd watching him play football? If not have a word with his football coach who should have taken a safeguarding course and can talk to gd. Your son should not be made to feel uncomfortable.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Smileless2012 - how dare you say I would use him to punish them. There’s a lot of assuming and mind reading going on in your post.

As I have said countless times on here - WE ARE REMOVING HIM AS THEY HAVE DAMAGED ME, MY WIFE AND BROTHER!

They have also caused a split between my mums two brothers to the point she wasn’t informed one of them had died.

Unresolved issues are not the reason here - their past behaviour is and our determination due history not to repeat itself.

Up until this point we haven’t taken him away due to us wanting him to have normal relationships.

But if this isn’t possible, it is neglectful of us to continue as it is.

Icr123 calm down. I know this is an emotive issue. We all want to protect our children and we all relate to things that have happened in the past which we don’t want them to suffer. Cutting ds off from his grandparents after 7 years could have a detrimental effect. So too can continuing with that relationship if it causes ds discomfort. So which is it? Does ds wish to continue seeing his gps?

Just read through this thread and I have to agree that there does seem to be a lot of unresolved anger and resentment towards your parents and sibling. It's a pity that you've been so annoyed with Smileless2012 because she seems to have spent a great deal of time and care unravelling the ongoing revelations, clarifying events and offering a good deal of insight and advice, as have so many others.

I was with you up until you mentioned your half joking resentment 're inheritance; frankly, this, I feel, should be the last thing you need to be fretting about. From what you've said here, and what your 5 counsellors have told you, it would seem that there is little, if any, prospect of a happy, sucessful, supportive and healthy relationship with your birth family and so in, your position, I would cease all further contact. You need to make a clear and steadfast decision now: are you going to enable your own childhood unhappiness, anxiety and resentment to be passed onto another generation or are you going to say that the buck stops with you; take control and protect your son's happiness and wellbeing?

I hope that you take on board all the helpful input that you've received here, even if you don't necessarily like it or agree with it. You should appreciate that people have taken the time and trouble to post. And please; forget the inheritance. Of all your problems, that's the least of them.

I have based all my responses on your original and subsequent posts 1cr; no mind reading or assumptions on my part.

You began by expressing your concerns over your son's welfare and as you've progressed, there has been an increased amount of focus by you, on your brother and his relationship with your parents.

When I first suggested there maybe some jealousy with regard to your brother, you said @ 13.20 there is no jealousy and then @ 13.50 said "yes there is jealousy that he will get a massive will".

I apologise if my responses have upset you but as I've said, everything has been based on the information you have given.

In my opinion, walk away.
Why would you want to be left a chunk of money by someone you despise so much.
It all sounds a ghastly mess, listen to what has been said, I’m sure counselling can be beneficial, but probably not if you just keep re hashing the same old grievances.
Before you jump down my throat, I do know where you are coming from, I estranged my mother twenty years ago, and have obviously put up with a lot to get me to that point, but trust me, better to put it behind you, concentrate on your own little family, and maybe take a long break from your parents.

Ditto Sara1954

Good advice Sara.