Estrangement

You must have me confused with someone else CommunityNotes, we never gifted our ES a house. With my brother, we provided a deposit to enable him to purchase his first property which the three of us agreed to transfer to the property they wanted to buy together.

The arrangement was that my brother would have his contribution returned when he was 60; they reneged on this agreement. It was also agreed that we would only request our investment to be returned if we needed the money; this never happened.

So, if you want to attempt to discredit me I suggest you stick to the facts but I understand why doing so would not work as we did nothing to justify our estrangement.

I await your apology but wont hold my breath.

Some of you here don't seem to realise the power some dils can have if children are involved. If a son's choice is between seeing his children or his mother of course he will choose his children - and rightly so. My experience is with a DS who complied with his wife for years - not because he wanted to but because he was trying to make the marriage work - which included trying to make her happy - which proved to be impossible.
Incidentally she also threatened that if he kept in touch with us she would tell people he had hit her.
Thank god he now has a new partner who doesn't want to control what he does or who he sees

An example of how coercive control works edddie . Thank goodness your son was able to break free from this toxic and abusive relationship .

Your post this morning at 6.09 clearly demonstrates that you know nothing about coercive control Grams so it would be a good idea to do some research into the subject.

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Fabricating information about a poster to pursue your own agenda is rather sad CommunityNotes but it's 'no skin off my nose' so you're wasting your time and the time of anyone who reads your nonsense.

CommunityNotes I hope Smilesless has a good solicitor and is currently consulting them about Defamation.

eddiecat .

March

*when I look at my group of friends, lots in other parts of the country, ALL of them that have been estranged have been because of a DIL.. so I would strongly question the comment made by Luminance*

It's not a personal experience is it?

No. This qualifies as gossip. Not being part of any of the relationships in question while getting tertiary information sourced from one side only is the least reputable way to have an informed opinion on any situation. The difference between forums like this and real-life is that the sole premise of these forums is getting one side. Discerning adults accept this arrangement the moment we post or read because we simply can’t get the other side by nature of the forum. But to apply such a biased, one sided thought process to in person relationships is imo irresponsible. Family conflicts contain nuance and are far too complex to be reduced solely to assumptions based on outside biased relationships (friends’ feelings alone etc). It’s an immature outlook to assume you know “the right” story or “the truth” when you are so far removed. But to then assign blame so matter of factly, wow.

Smileless2012

An example of how coercive control works edddie . Thank goodness your son was able to break free from this toxic and abusive relationship .

Your post this morning at 6.09 clearly demonstrates that you know nothing about coercive control Grams so it would be a good idea to do some research into the subject.

I know plenty. And I. Oh it’s not as prevalent as you make it. But I also know far too many estranged parents who remain so in part because they have refused to see not only their own part in it but their children’s. It’s always those pesky dils. Without them those sons would have remained under the parents control for life ! Yes coercive control exists and so do parents who look anywhere to blame but at their own. If it’s the dil after all it means they’re blame free because “the child they raised would never “. It’s sad really, it’s probably the same attitude that gets some into the mess. Often times adult children are just tolerating their parents behavior because they’re used to it , and then someone new comes around and they realize this isn’t how it should be ! My poor husband had never seen a not dysfunctional family up close until
We were married - and then he started to look inward and say wow - all those little feelings I pushed down were right - that was wrong! No one should
Act like that ! But had you asked my lil
Back when she’d have said they had the perfect relationship! Some dils create issues of course but also a lot of parents create fantasies where their perfect family and their golden Boy were just corrupted by some scheming hussy rather than look in a mirror. A LOT of parents.

Doesn't saying that you know far too many estranged parents who remain so in part because they have refused to see not only their own part in it but their children's qualify as gossip Grams?

Be careful or you'll have BlessedArt chastising you if you talk about what you've gleaned from people that you know, and aren't talking about your own personal experience.

Then again if you were, we'd only be privy to 'one side of the story' and that's not good enough either is it. But what am I saying, as long as you're having a go at EP's it doesn't matter does it; anything goes.

Just like your poor husband, our ES's wife hadn't seen a not dysfunctional family up close until she was introduced to ours but she didn't like that either.

As I've said before, it doesn't matter how prevalent coercive control of an AC is as the reason for estrangement; it happens. So rather than treat those who say this is the reason they've been estranged with scorn, how about a little open mindedness.

Rather than assume that all the parents estranged are like your m.i.l., put your bias aside and listen to what's being said. It's really not that difficult. I believe what you've said about your m.i.l. so how about extending the same courtesy to the EP's who post here on GN.

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Your son chose his behavior. She didn’t bewitch him or brainwash him. I doubt she held a weapon to him. He CHOSE not to have. Relationship with his parents. Now that may well have been a cruel and horrible choice but it was his and his alone. His relationship with you was his to manage his to nurture or abandon. He chose the later

Grams2five In a later post to this above you say that you know plenty (I think you mean about coercive control)

Your post above does suggest that perhaps you know less about the nature of and impact on others behaviours and choices, of coercive control, than you think.

I agree Madgran.

Coercive control is akin to brainwashing as anyone with any knowledge of the subject should know.

'Its us (her or him and the children) or them (the parents) is a weapon. It may not inflict bodily or physical harm but the psychological damage can be just as devastating, when faced with choosing between the parents who love you and your wife/husband and children.

Theres also Adults that want a relationship with one parent but the other parent doesn't like it? What happens then

Isn't that a form of control?

We've had a couple of posters in this unenviable situation and if my memory serves me well, despite how difficult it was for the parent that couldn't see the AC, the one that could was doing so.

Depending on the circumstances it could be a form of control on the part of the AC but I'm not sure I'd say that of the parent being excluded who found it too hurtful and upsetting knowing that their husband or wife was seeing the AC and possibly GC too, that they've been estranged from.

But that's an example of cohesive control?

I'd say that of the parent being excluded who found it too hurtful and upsetting knowing that their husband or wife was seeing the AC and possibly GC too, that they've been estranged from.

No. They should put their relationship aside and let the other parent crack on with a relationship with their child and grandchild.

Just like the DIL/SIL having a shitty relationship with that inlaws.

Why should they March; just because you say so?

That's a decision that a couple will make for themselves.

Did you mean coercive control BTW in your post @ 19.46?

Smileless2012

Doesn't saying that you know far too many estranged parents who remain so in part because they have refused to see not only their own part in it but their children's qualify as gossip Grams?

Be careful or you'll have BlessedArt chastising you if you talk about what you've gleaned from people that you know, and aren't talking about your own personal experience.

Then again if you were, we'd only be privy to 'one side of the story' and that's not good enough either is it. But what am I saying, as long as you're having a go at EP's it doesn't matter does it; anything goes.

Just like your poor husband, our ES's wife hadn't seen a not dysfunctional family up close until she was introduced to ours but she didn't like that either.

As I've said before, it doesn't matter how prevalent coercive control of an AC is as the reason for estrangement; it happens. So rather than treat those who say this is the reason they've been estranged with scorn, how about a little open mindedness.

Rather than assume that all the parents estranged are like your m.i.l., put your bias aside and listen to what's being said. It's really not that difficult. I believe what you've said about your m.i.l. so how about extending the same courtesy to the EP's who post here on GN.

Smileless you’re an adult.

You know full well there nothing objective about “all my friends who are estranged are because of the DIL”. You think someone who says something like that has a clue about both sides of the situation? She knows all her friends’ DILs from all over the country? Their thoughts? The communications between these women and their husbands? Please. All of these completely unrelated women are the cause of men breaking away from their parents? All of them happen to have the same friend in common who is also struggling with their son or daughter? She simply cannot know all of the involved parties well enough for her to make such bold proclamations of blame. She made a sweeping comment gleaned from gossip. For someone who I’ve seen quite often speak about the negatives of generalising on this subject, you sure are selective about when it offends you.

Fwiw, friends can be our mirrors. If I had multiple friends all over the country who were are estranged from their children and partners, I’d self-reflect a bit to see why such a coincidence is even possible.

No one knows both sides of the story BlessedArt unless they have an intimate knowledge of all those involved.

The friends of an EAC only have their side, as do the friends of the EP.

We don't know how well pascal knows the friends she referred too but because a d.i.l. being a major player when a son estranges his parents doesn't suit your narrative, whenever it's mentioned you always argue against it, and you accuse me of being selective!!!

Maybe you should self-reflect a bit on some of the posts you make.

Why all this talk about dil's I haven't one but can see some might have. They are estranged isn't that enough? Some have a narcissist to try to deal with, nigh on impossible! Some just a selfish, self serving AC. There are many reasons, or not, in some curcumstances.

I think it is rather just to stand up against any and all sweeping generalisations for anyone wishing this forum to be welcoming and productive. Sure if that does not happen that is a generalisation in and of itself? That one person is worth defending and another not based on who they are in an estranged relationship would make for an incredible bias of thinking.

That one person is worth defending and another not based on who they are in an estranged relationship would make for an incredible bias of thinking exactly Luminance, and is what we see time and time again when an EP is sharing their experience of the wife of their ES.

This does rather work both ways I feel, I am sure many estranged children deserve a better response as well in the partners they have chosen to love. People are themselves throughout their lives. Those who are perhaps jealous of controling DILs would surely be the ones who become jealous and controling MILs one day. The egg becomes the chicken so to speak. It would be rather short sighted to believe otherwise. I hope you agree.