Riots in Southport

Galaxy

Paul Embry who is a voice on the left that i pretty much agree with on everything has just summed up the issue with the way far right has been used. I am paraphrasing now, 'if you call Brexit far right, people who raise concerns about borders as far right, people who say women need single sex spaces as far right then dont be surprised when people doubt your words when you describe people as far right'.

👏👏👏

He has made very valid points, which I totally agree with.

Far right is as meaningless as Woke both are lazy descriptions when the writer cannot be bothered to use an informed explanation.

SueEH, that is an excellent "Verify" article with an incredible amount of in depth research on the different social media streams and how they perpetrate false news and violent reactions.

It's very good in identifying leading figures and what their politics are, and the factors attracting. people to join. so yes, highly recommended read.

SueEH

My daughter lives in Southport and has colleagues who were affected by the murders. She went to the peaceful vigil and was then terrified by the ensuing violence. She had a police helicopter hovering outside her window for hours.
The people discussed in this BBC Verify report are truly dangerous.

Violent Southport protests reveal organising tactics of the far-right www.bbc.com/news/articles/cl4y0453nv5o

Yes that confirms exactly what the police and the security services are saying.

We simply cannot treat these people the same as other groups because they are much more of a threat than anything we see elsewhere in the U.K.

Callistemon213

DH has just told me that one arrested today on suspicion of arson in Hartlepool is 11 .

Good grief!

Iam64

And - at what stage is it possible to stop people wearing balaclavas and face coverings. Muslim women are in a different category to rioters

I think the protesters at the pro Palestine marches were told not to wear face coverings. I did notice a couple of people wearing face coverings in the clip I saw on the news.
I don’t really care whether they’re labelled far right or far left, I’ve got my own label for them, vile thugs.

sazz1

Firstly I think it's terrible to riot when people are grieving for dead children.
Having said that there are many many people in this country who are not happy about mass illegal immigration via boats. As Starmer has stopped the Rwanda deportation project, has no plan on what he's doing instead, has stopped winter fuel payments, has ordered many new houses to be built etc people are very concerned with what he's doing. And some extremists are now taking matters into their own hands. I disagree with the disgusting violence against police and police dogs but I'm not exactly surprised by it

Yet with this statement there is a veiled support !

I agree people are angry,ignored ,one rule for one set of people and another for the other.We want fairness and what is going on in this country is a complete bias against it's own people.Each government party expects it's own people to bend over backwards for

Camille333

I agree people are angry,ignored ,one rule for one set of people and another for the other.We want fairness and what is going on in this country is a complete bias against it's own people.Each government party expects it's own people to bend over backwards for

Then people should write to newspapers, write to their MP’s; write to other people’s MP’s. It’s still no reason to attack the police, their dogs and their vehicles.

Tear gas affects the police who use it too - my policeman son has been in hospital over this.
There are some people who are determined to stir up trouble and the mindless thugs who perpetrated the violence are easy to manipulate.
It's important that we all keep open minds because 'disinformation' wears many masks

Syracute I think it's a bit out of order to attribute 'veiled support' for violence to sazzl
No-one in their right mind supports this kind of thing, but the sort of attitude that attributes 'veiled support' for violence to anyone who speaks out against immigration is exactly what fuels the frustration of those people - and I am one - who can see the problems. We are not talking about war-torn families - men, women and children - arriving here for succour. The concern is the number of single young men who are coming here, to be fed, housed, cared for, given money... This is not covered on mainstream media. Those concerns are silenced. We have been manipulated into self-censorship - 'Do not DARE say a word against immigration, or you will be spurned and called racist'
It is not racist to be concerned about one's culture and to wish to safeguard it
It is not racist to be concerned about the dangers uncontrolled immigration from cultures more brutal than ours (yes, I said BRUTAL) can pose to our grandchildren.
It's time we turned 'woke' into 'awake' and were more realistic.
Otherwise there will be many more incidents such as Southport

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Iam64

And - at what stage is it possible to stop people wearing balaclavas and face coverings. Muslim women are in a different category to rioters

I think there should be NO face coverings in the streets. At all. France has banned the burqa too. Very sensible. It ought to be one rule FOR EVERYONE. No exceptions. No balaclavas, no masks. Faces need to be seen by everyone for everybody.

Urmstongran

Iam64

And - at what stage is it possible to stop people wearing balaclavas and face coverings. Muslim women are in a different category to rioters

I think there should be NO face coverings in the streets. At all. France has banned the burqa too. Very sensible. It ought to be one rule FOR EVERYONE. No exceptions. No balaclavas, no masks. Faces need to be seen by everyone for everybody.

I tend to agree on this.

Just to clear one thing up the EDL disbanded 10 years ago, i am sick to death of people banding this about without getting their facts righr!

And once again, the EDL disbanded 10 years ago and you go on about misinformation its laughable!

Otherwise there will be many more incidents such as Southport

What is the link between this crime ( which is too ghastly to comprehend) and young men arriving on boats?

Please,spit it out.

WW3 states the EDL were subsequently banned. I don’t know for sure if they were but I have heard many commentators stating it’s a defunct organisation. I accept their members will still be active though.

Reading the governments list of proscribed organisations is rather illuminating though.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/proscribed-terror-groups-or-organisations--2/proscribed-terrorist-groups-or-organisations-accessible-version

It started when a person of a certain religion was found and arrested heading to the vigil with a machete

As if by magic, vans full of creatures wearing specially designed items of clothing turn up? Too hideous to even type the details.

SWT61

And once again, the EDL disbanded 10 years ago and you go on about misinformation its laughable!

Think they just morphed into UKIP
‘Decline: 2013–present
By early 2013, commentators believed that the EDL was in decline, reflected in the decreasing numbers attending its events, Robinson's imprisonment, and its failure to enter electoral politics.[48] Groups which had closely allied to the EDL, such as Casuals United and March for England, were reasserting their individual identities.[56] Splinter groups appeared, among them the North West Infidels, North East Infidels, South East Alliance and Combined Ex-Forces.[81] Some of these, such as the North West Infidels and South East Alliance, adopted more extreme perspectives, cooperating with the fascist National Front and making reference to the white supremacist Fourteen Words slogan on their social media.[56] Other activists moved away from the EDL to focus on campaigning for Brexit, the UK's exit from the European Union.[56] It is possible that the electoral growth of the right-wing UK Independence Party (UKIP) in this period also contributed to the EDL's decline, with many EDL supporters finding it easier to vote for UKIP than physically attend EDL events.[82] In April 2013, the EDL leadership requested that members use tactical voting to benefit UKIP; the latter responded by distancing itself from the EDL.[83]’.

SWT61

And once again, the EDL disbanded 10 years ago and you go on about misinformation its laughable!

What do they call themselves now?

The EDL was banned not abandoned.

That is why there are no identifiable groups being set up now.

Wyllow3

Yes, the murdered girls. I found this picture in the Daily Mail or some of the protestors (hope you don't mind me posting it on the other thread as well Maybee)

As well as chants "oh Tommy Robinson" etc

This brand of far right is organised very differently from traditional politics, but that doesnt mean they dont exist!

But SWT61 is adamant the EDL has been 'disbanded'.

How?

Who are they in the picture !?!

undines

Syracute I think it's a bit out of order to attribute 'veiled support' for violence to sazzl
No-one in their right mind supports this kind of thing, but the sort of attitude that attributes 'veiled support' for violence to anyone who speaks out against immigration is exactly what fuels the frustration of those people - and I am one - who can see the problems. We are not talking about war-torn families - men, women and children - arriving here for succour. The concern is the number of single young men who are coming here, to be fed, housed, cared for, given money... This is not covered on mainstream media. Those concerns are silenced. We have been manipulated into self-censorship - 'Do not DARE say a word against immigration, or you will be spurned and called racist'
It is not racist to be concerned about one's culture and to wish to safeguard it
It is not racist to be concerned about the dangers uncontrolled immigration from cultures more brutal than ours (yes, I said BRUTAL) can pose to our grandchildren.
It's time we turned 'woke' into 'awake' and were more realistic.
Otherwise there will be many more incidents such as Southport

So once again a supportive argument for people that get incited by racism .

I think I can clarify.

The BBC verify article quoted above explains how the former "official members" of the EDL disbanded but continue to be active and how the network of far right individuals operates together.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cl4y0453nv5o

Section from the article:

"Merseyside Police have publicly identified the English Defence League (EDL) as a key factor.

While there are people who describe themselves as EDL supporters, the organisation ceased to exist in any formal sense after its founder, Stephen Yaxley-Lennon - who uses the alias Tommy Robinson - focused on spreading his message on social media platforms, where he has a sizeable following.

But its core ideas - in particular an opposition to illegal immigration, mixed with hate predominantly aimed at Muslims - are very much alive, and loudly and widely spread among sympathisers online.

Thrown into this mix are tropes from conspiracy theories that “elites” are somehow covering up the truth - including the abuse of British children.

An influencer on X associated with Yaxley-Lennon, who posts under the name of “Lord Simon”, was among the first to publicly call for nationwide protests.

His account promoted false claims that the alleged Southport attacker had been an asylum seeker, recently arrived in the UK by boat. His video has been viewed over a million times.

“We have to hit the streets. We have to make a huge impact all around the country. Every city needs to go up everywhere,” he said"

Hope that helps re EDL and use of social networks.

Syracute

undines

Syracute I think it's a bit out of order to attribute 'veiled support' for violence to sazzl
No-one in their right mind supports this kind of thing, but the sort of attitude that attributes 'veiled support' for violence to anyone who speaks out against immigration is exactly what fuels the frustration of those people - and I am one - who can see the problems. We are not talking about war-torn families - men, women and children - arriving here for succour. The concern is the number of single young men who are coming here, to be fed, housed, cared for, given money... This is not covered on mainstream media. Those concerns are silenced. We have been manipulated into self-censorship - 'Do not DARE say a word against immigration, or you will be spurned and called racist'
It is not racist to be concerned about one's culture and to wish to safeguard it
It is not racist to be concerned about the dangers uncontrolled immigration from cultures more brutal than ours (yes, I said BRUTAL) can pose to our grandchildren.
It's time we turned 'woke' into 'awake' and were more realistic.
Otherwise there will be many more incidents such as Southport

So once again a supportive argument for people that get incited by racism .

Yup!