Difficult daughter

Very good advice from eazybee, well worth taking it.

My daughter was sensible with budgeting until after her third child was born.

Her irresponsible behaviour has worked very wel for her so far. Her husband told her and she continued until he left.

Your support is making her worse.

If she is on low income she will get housing benefits and tax credits, why are you paying for things?

She won't grow up and manage her own affairs while you do that.

There are debt orders she can get to sort her finances out.

Let her be the same as other adults who have to struggle, it won't do her any harm.

This is a horrible situation, and I sympathise. While I think it unlikely in the circumstances that she will withhold contact with the grandchildren, how many people know that in the UK grandparents have NO automatic rights of contact whatsoever with their grandchildren? The adult (?) children therefore call all the shots, and can tell the grandparents, often vulnerable and in imperfect health, what they must give and what to do rather than ask them, as happened to me. This is a situation that needs to be changed - I help to run a local support group for non-contact grandparents, and have links with organisations throughout the UK, notably the Bristol Grandparents Support Group. Earlier this year there was a parliamentary petition, but this was cancelled because of the snap General Election. Anyone who would like more information is welcome to send me a PM.

Have you checked that your daughter is getting all the help she is entitled to from the state? If she is working and her income is low, she should be getting child tax credits and working tax credits possibly along with other help. She should certainly be getting enough to live on without the little luxuries we all take for granted.
My daughter is living close to the breadline but she has made her bed and must lie in it. I helped her initially by finding out about what she could claim and, when she went through a bad patch thinking she was too good for benefits, I filled in the paperwork for her. Now I help her sometimes with the luxuries, baby-sitting and paying if we go out for a meal because life can be very drab without being made to feel special but I wouldn't feel I was doing her any favours if I cushioned her from real life. I won't be here forever and I want her to be able to think she can cope without me.
The 'cut off' notice from Mum and Dad's bank seems a very good way forward (remain calm in the face of the inevitable storm) and be generous when you can afford to. Keep to the script that you are trying to assist her to be independent which will make her feel better in the long run. Oh, do make sure you and your husband are in full agreement as to the extent of your help because most manipulators love to divide and conquer. Good luck.

My daughter has not spoken to me for over ten years since I stopped paying for everything ! I paid off her Uni student loan, her overdraft, her rent, bought her a car, gave her a credit card which I paid for, paid for her holidays and flights over to see us, for her and the boyfriend at the time. After one Uni, she did an unfunded fourth year for a professional qualification, for which I paid. She was a brilliant teenager, and sixth former, she cooked me a hot meal every night when I came in from my full time job ...ironed, cleaned the house, and was so amazing it was unbelivable ! She suddenly cut me off with no further contact when she said she and her then boyfriend would be coming over for a holiday and bringing his children ..two young children ...Fine, lovely I said ...and planned all the things we could do and places to take them ...I was looking forward to it, and texted her to ask for dates so I could pick them up from the airport, etc...only one terse reply 'Stop texting me'...cut me off from all social media, no contact whatever ! Was even told not to send cards as they would go into the bin ! No falling out, no rows, nothing ...theONLY reason I can fatham is that I did not offer to pay for the first time ever, for the hotel at the airport the flights spending money etc ....she has, or had, a really good well paid job ...now the only way I can 'see' her is to look online at the company she now runs with the latest boyfriend ! There is a photo of them as a family on his boat ...have no idea if the child is his or hers or theirs ! SO ...unless you want perhaps to lose your daughter and contact with your GC's ...tread carefully but DO NOT keep bailing her out ...you will need your money for your retirement ! Hard but necessary ! Good luck

Please stop doing so much for your daughter as you are contributing to her immaturity in facing up to her responsibilities. She is an adult and it's time to face up to hard facts of life. If you don't pay rent you get evicted..if you don't pay energy bills ..you get cut off! These are simple lessons we all have to learn but if our parents are naive enough to keep bailing us out then what incentive is there to learn?
Please, you need to harden up... and force her to take responsibility and realise the importance of bill paying versus manicured nails.
Like the mother bird that forces the chick out their nest, knowing there is a possibility their chick could get hurt but equally knowing it has to be done in order to learn to survive.
It is time to force your daughter to grow up and the lessons she needs to learn in order to pass the necessary life skills on to her children when it is their time to face the adult world.

I really feel for you. Your health and your grandchildren must come first. How about withdrawing the money you are giving for her bills, and offering to contribute to after school childcare instead? It would be a fraction of what you are paying now, and would take the burden from you, and benefit the gc.

You have the right to say no and it is essential for your own health and state of mind and that of your husband that you take a firmer stand. She will be angry with you for it but she is not considerate as it is and you have to be firm. It is not easy if you are not used to is but what is the alternative? - your husband working until he drops? - you working yourself into an early grave? You will probably fall out with her anyway when you are unable to continue doing it so better to get things sorted now.

How old are the children? Maybe if they are still preschool and primary age, she would not find a lot of difference financially if she gave up work?
I think it's time to put your OH and your own well being first or you won't be able to help her even if you want to to.
The three month withdrawal is a good idea and can co incide with your OH's retirement ( tell her that any anyway). She needs to grow up and can't do this if she is treated as if she is unable to be like other women of her age - ie. coping with day to day life management skills. Three months should help her acquire these skills.
Also, I would tell her if the rudeness continues the time scale will reduce. Harsh I know but this situation is well out of hand!

I can identify with some of this, but my family member was very grateful so we didn’t feel used. Decide firmly what u can cope with, u are no use to anyone if u make urself ill. Discuss with ur husband what u will provide as far as bills and childcare, put it in writing, give her it and tell her when it will start. Go with her to Citizen’s advice to discuss exactly what her husband has to provide, and what allowances she can get. Eazybee talks a lot of sense. Tough love.

Thank you all so very much!! I am overwhelmed by your support in this and you have given me the strength and determination I need to
a) convince my hubby that it's ok to not do so much
And b) reduce this terible guilt I have felt that we can't leave her and the kids in a mess
I see only too clearly that its time to make drastic changes because she's got to take responsibility for her life now. She's not grateful or pleasant whether we do these things or not.
Thank you all so much. I'm so pleased I joined this site

Similar situation with my son. Have chronic illness myself and having to help my son out with bits as he has terrible depression and anxiety. He says he can’t ‘Adult ‘ as he puts it. I have had to step back as I can’t afford to do it anymore. I have told him he will he have to learn how to ‘ Adult ‘ as I won’t always be around. If we keep helping our kids out how will they learn how to cope and deal with life. It’s difficult because I will always want to help but the kindest thing we can do is not.

Dana6789 they're 10, 5 and nearly 4
She is slightly better off working and when the youngest is 5 she would have to find a job anyway.
Time to enforce growing up!

Carolebarrel we have alot of thinking to do.
DS64till yes I'm with you here. Doing too much is as damaging as not enough.
Easybee thank you!

Yes she needs proper maintenance from her ex husband. I’m not sure if the CSA still exists but there must be some agency that can work out how much he should pay.

Is family counselling still available because there is a lack of respect on her side. If so it would be good to meet with a counsellor to resolve your differences.

You have acted to support your daughter through love but she has taken advantage of you and now needs some ‘tough love’. Despite all the education and opportunities available to young people many of them have no concept of a budget and how to work within it, it is too easy to get credit to get the things they want rather than need. Perhaps a simple list of income and expenditure for your daughter would help her see what her priorities should be and perhaps you should show her your income and expenditure and how much is going on her rather than your well deserved retirement fund.

It sounds to me that she has no respect for herself, therefore she will have none for anyone else or you.

I remember when my first husband walked out on me (an affair). I was paid NOTHING for our two children and I had to pay for everything, including the debt he allowed to accumulate on our mortgage and utility bills (unbeknown to me).

I almost lost the house, but I was in full time work and have always worked, even during weekends and school holidays so the work ethic was strong in me.

It's difficult for her to adjust to this new way of living, but adjust she must. Perhaps socialising and going out is her way of escaping the reality, because the reality is scary. She is not ready to accept her life as it is now.

Whatever the reasons for the end of her marriage, there are two sides to every story and the only people who know the truth are the people involved.

I wonder if it's possible to have a calm conversation with your daughter about how things really are for her. It may be her disrespect towards you is a form of control in her life - the only thing she can control at the moment. If not, counselling might help you and your DH, if only to offload and begin to see a different way forward.

I really hope this situation will become less stressful for you.

It is hard but you are doing her no favours, she has to learn to stand up for herself. You brought her up and now is your time to enjoy retirement. Don't let her bully you, if you look after the children more and your husband keeps working you will be too exhausted to enjoy your time. Give her some support of course but tell her you are not fit enough to keep it up for ever, that your husband needs to retire, you love her and the children but can't be mother to them and her. She needs to sort out child care with her ex, he needs to arrange some of it if he can't do it himself.

I am one of the ones who HAS experienced a DD being left with three children and unable to cope (reason I found GN in first place) and yes I am going to be critical of this situation also.

Goodgran, I think you need to assert yourself a lot more. She is taking the proverbial P - to put it bluntly. You can only hold her hand so much but she has to 'fix' things herself.

I know its hard when you love your children but for your own sanity you need to set boundaries and let her know you will always help where you can but there are limits. 9 months paying her way is far too long!

My DD couldn't even get CSA to make her ex pay any maintenance (its still ongoing) so she applied for help.

I pointed her in the right direction (as she was so upset she was barely functioning at the time) I did all I could help practically but I knew I could not carry on co-parenting her children and once she had sorted herself out with rented accommodation, housing benefit etc we had discussions about childcare. I readily admitted I really couldn't cope with looking after her children while she went to work, so she has to pay but she gets some help with childcare.

Single parents should receive enough either in tax credits or other benefits to feed their children and keep a roof over their heads. It doesn't automatically mean they can have the best of holidays/cars/clothes but they should get enough for the basics.

If you DD cuts you out because you don't do exactly as she asks then leave it, give her some cooling time. Don't be blackmailed.

Like you I felt torn between wanting some peace and quiet in old age and wanting to help my lovely family. I feel I am getting there (although still have lots of kids a lot of the time, but it is when I choose to which makes all the difference) I still can't please myself entirely (like take off on holiday at short notice) but I don't feel so drained and I take time out for myself without feeling guilty.

You will get there, am sure but be assertive and positive.

PS Hope this is making sense - have got a cat trying to type at same time!!!

Goodgran, I feel for you. I totally understand why you've done so much for dd - and why you want to pull back now. I'm glad you're giving her 3 months notice. Even so, I hope you do this gradually - let her know you'll be cutting back every 3 months or 6 months or something, rather than pulling the rug out from under her all at once.

I also think you're too enmeshed financially. If she can pay the rent herself, then she should do it directly, imo. She would probably be more responsible about it if she did that. The reason she isn't is because she knows mum and dad can't "evict" her if she lets it go. Dh needs to cut those apron strings.

It sounds as if there was more going on in her marriage than just financial issues if she changed all of a sudden. You really can't know, so please don't judge.

The kids shouldn't suffer for it though. Dd really needs to go after their dad for proper maintenance. The kids deserve to lead as good a life as possible even though the parents aren't together.

You have to change to meet conditions. This is financial abuse. Cancel the payments you make, tell her to go and get help with her debts (CAP = Christians Against Poverty) are very good. It's for anyone Christian, secular or a n other) Time she took responsibility. Your enabling her to stay dependant on you and that's your part. She will say she never wants to see you again until she needs baby sitting help. Take the power back and tell her where to get help

Many years ago I got divorced with 5 children between 4 and 14 years. The Court awarded me £1 a week for each child and 1 shilling a year for me. Even then I had difficulty getting him to pay up. Obviously £5 then was worth more then it would be now but even then it was peanuts.)

Apologies for hi-jacking this thread but to VIOLETTE. Your story is horrendous, absolutely heartbreaking..... Have you posted it anywhere for proper responses? - sorry back to Goodgran.............

All the time you keep giving, you are enabling her to continue to live this way, it’s so not fair to you.Eazybee’s advice is spot on. Look after your health and make your daughter and her ex face up to their own responsiblilites.

since our children were teenagers we always had the same rule,pay all your bills first if you're short or you want cash for a night out or special occassion ask and we'll be happy to help.It has always worked well ,of course there are times when they need a helping hand FOR the bills too ,as in now when my son has changed job and it will be 5 weeks until his next wage so we're paying his rent and helping with other things .Its only once in a blue moon it happens though .Maybe try that rule with your daughter and see how she takes it