Son is pushing us away

Smileless2012

Or maybe feeling guilty .

Perhaps. Or maybe wishing to be under less parental control.

Or just stressed out trying to please everyone. Being in the middle is not easy.

I haven't seen anything from the OP to suggest that there's any parental control, but enough that would be reason for her son to feel guilty and maybe should be Norah.

Susie1183. There are some thoughtless often nasty people on here. You are very hurt, and so is your husband. Ignore these posts, try and carry on with the company and love of the rest of your family. Take some happy photos, enjoy those grandchildren while they are young. Life will go on and work out. We are on here to help you through, not criticise.

Norah Or maybe wishing to be under less parental control

There is nothing that the OP has said that even vaguely suggests parental control

His father is quite entitled to express his feelings about such a last minute cancellation caused apparently by his DiL arranging something on a date that has been in the diary for sometime and which they had agreed to attend. That isnt "parental control" either!

If it’s a school activity, at least one of the children is probably involved, so it’s not just the Dil arranging something else on purpose. It could be a genuine balancing act where the children have been put first.

Probably I would have told my children they had to stick to the prior arrangement but there again it depends on the age and the importance of the activity.

But I do think it’s a bit unfair to make it sound as if she’s off on some kind of jolly to please herself. School activities rarely equal pleasure for adults.

Madgran77

*Norah Or maybe wishing to be under less parental control*

There is nothing that the OP has said that even vaguely suggests parental control

His father is quite entitled to express his feelings about such a last minute cancellation caused apparently by his DiL arranging something on a date that has been in the diary for sometime and which they had agreed to attend. That isnt "parental control" either!

OP In the last two years he has gradually withdrawn a lot from both us as parents and his siblings, who are both really upset. As a family we have wondered if he is depressed and tried to come up with options, but he has rejected all approaches, for example suggestions from his brother of a boys weekend away walking and canoeing (which they both love to do). Last Summer his brother and family went on holiday close to where they live especially to try to see him and let the children see each other. He saw them for one afternoon but was withdrawn and left when his wife said they should go home. My other son was exasperated and didn’t know what to do.

^"He always makes an excuse (he hasn’t come to the last two christenings).

They're all judging DS, attempting to control, imo.

He could pay for his room, he agreed to come along but changed his mind. OP is not at fault for DS change of plans.

Norah They're all judging DS, attempting to control, imo

Or they are a family who are worried about him and trying to maintain contact because his behavior has changed quite drastically and he appears to be behaving out of character.

Trying to work out why because one is worried is not "judging"! It is a way of trying to work out a way forward in a relationship. They may or may not be getting it wrong but it's not "judging" to try!

Why do some appear ton think that when your son or daughter leaves home and makes a life of their own, you resign yourself to no contact.

If there was a school activity on the Saturday it would have been arranged last term and they would have known the date, and could have presented a cast-iron excuse in good time.
It is the late notification of non-attendance that is the cause for concern, and the son's rudeness to his father rather than an apology that is at issue.
It is clear they do not wish to participate in family events which is their choice, but they could at least make this clear before preparations are made. Equally, parents have to accept that not all family members want or enjoy large extended family gatherings.

Allsorts

Why do some appear ton think that when your son or daughter leaves home and makes a life of their own, you resign yourself to no contact.

Quite, Allsorts! Does not make sense to me atall!

Probably because they're not estranged so have no idea what it's like Allsorts and Madgran.

Exactly eazybee cancelling so late and swearing at his father are the cause of concern.

Well possibly Smileless but empathy and consideration of all the nuances of relationships does not depend on that in relation to this OP and particular situation. 🤔

I agree Madgran but those not estranged or having problems with their relationship with their AC appear to be the ones unwilling or unable to have empathy or consider the nuances here.

Smileless2012

I agree Madgran but those not estranged or having problems with their relationship with their AC appear to be the ones unwilling or unable to have empathy or consider the nuances here.

No. Many of those who have good relationships with their children have said DS was rude swearing at his father and cancelling late. However, parental control need not be exerted.

Lovely if DS could repay his parents the cost of the holiday.

Yes Norah but even when the rudeness has been acknowledged, the reasoning around the OPs "culpability" for the situation arising has been astounding in some cases.

What exactly are you identifying from what the OP has said as "parental control" by the way

Madgran77

Yes Norah but even when the rudeness has been acknowledged, the reasoning around the OPs "culpability" for the situation arising has been astounding in some cases.

What exactly are you identifying from what the OP has said as "parental control" by the way

Attempt control of AC visiting each other, and other siblings attempting to control visits. Several examples given by OP.

'We really wanted to have all of our children and grandchildren together, which hasn’t happened for 4 years'.

Parents want what they want, AC may not always be available.

Last Summer his brother and family went on holiday close to where they live especially to try to see him and let the children see each other. He saw them for one afternoon but was withdrawn and left when his wife said they should go home. My other son was exasperated and didn’t know what to do.

Siblings want what they want for their own reasons, nothing to say all family members need to agree with being controlled.

DS should return money, issue apologies for phone incident. The entire family should back away allowing tensions to calm for as long as necessary.

"We invited our 3 children and their partners"; control!!!
"We discussed where to go with all the children"; control!!!

Sorry Norah but can't find where the OP's other children are attempting to control visits unless you're referring to them inviting their brother to their children's christenings.

Smileless2012

"We invited our 3 children and their partners"; control!!!
"We discussed where to go with all the children"; control!!!

Sorry Norah but can't find where the OP's other children are attempting to control visits unless you're referring to them inviting their brother to their children's christenings.

Attempting control is not accepting DS may decline invites.

DS may not be declining politely, or so it seems.

Perhaps "no thank you" could be his response, refuse to discuss.

Or so it seems!!! You must be joking Norah. He's cancelled having already agreed to go, swore at his father and at the time of the OP's post hadn't even offered to refund them.

No thank you should have been his response last August when they were originally invited.

My late father in law didn,t want me to marry his son he made life difficult for me when we visited.
He loved our children but still took any chance to dismiss what I said and it was very clear for over 30 years what his opinion of me was.
Consequently my husband used to make excuses not to visit them …sometimes using me as the excuse..but really because he didn,t like the atmosphere
I was the person who bought and gave presents and cards to his family made the celebration cakes for birthdays and anniversaries so it hurt that I was disliked.
Just before he died he told me that he couldn,t have picked a better wife for his son.
Shame he didn,t realise his son knew better than he did even way back when we were you .
Sometimes parents project THEIR feeling on the daughter or son in law and often they couldn,t be further from the truth.
If you clear.y have issues,she,ll know and and he might be staying away to save his WIFE from hurt .
Just my view.

*Norah So my understanding is that you view:

1. Parents inviting their AC to a birthday celebration weekend with all the family getting together as "attempting to control".

2. Siblings arranging to holiday fairly near another sibling to provide an opportunity to catch up as "attempting to control".

Am I correct in my understanding?

paddyann54

My late father in law didn,t want me to marry his son he made life difficult for me when we visited.
He loved our children but still took any chance to dismiss what I said and it was very clear for over 30 years what his opinion of me was.
Consequently my husband used to make excuses not to visit them …sometimes using me as the excuse..but really because he didn,t like the atmosphere
I was the person who bought and gave presents and cards to his family made the celebration cakes for birthdays and anniversaries so it hurt that I was disliked.
Just before he died he told me that he couldn,t have picked a better wife for his son.
Shame he didn,t realise his son knew better than he did even way back when we were you .
Sometimes parents project THEIR feeling on the daughter or son in law and often they couldn,t be further from the truth.
If you clear.y have issues,she,ll know and and he might be staying away to save his WIFE from hurt .
Just my view.

Yes paddyann that could be the situation and the reason. I am sorry that you endured that yourself. However the way the OP writes about this problem, including their efforts to include the DiL, and the way the siblings as well as the parents seem worried about him does not particularly suggest it in this case.

Either way the son and DiL are certainly making it more difficult for themselves by agreeing; son showing enthusiasm and then pulling out last minute. And the son previously telling his mum he is unhappy in his marriage also suggests that this may well not be the miserable situation that you sadly faced.

Norah Attempting control is not accepting DS may decline invites

No it's not! It is understandable disappointment after:

1. the invitation was accepted;
2. the son expressed excitement and aid he was looking forward to it a few weeks before
3. DiL arranging to help at the school and strangely the dog no longer having a carer, despite originally they were apparently both coming without the dog!!

The OP has said nothing that suggests she thinks her AC can't decline an invitation if they want to. She could have done without them declining in the way that they did which is no way to treat anyone, least if all your family!

🤔!!

If you have just had your weekend away, with some of the family, I hope it went well enough, and that you both were able to relax and enjoy yourself, after all of that disappointment.